Largo (Bergmann) and .38 ACP calibers. YouTube personality, Graham Baates, gives us a video breakdown and review of the Llama Max-1 1911 Handgun in .45 acp. Registered Member. Spanish Year of Proof Codes for Star, Llama, Astra and others. inspection and displayed no ill effects from the proof firing, it was stamped After Spanish civil war, company moved its facilities to Vitoria, Spain, where it . Automatic pistols made by Gabilondo from 1914 to 1933 were based on Browning F.N. Unscrew and remove the trigger guard from the frame. Mike, none of the marks you show are the date code. hb```b``e` cc`a &! Llama made a lot of different 9mms and .45s. The one at the top looks like an original used Llama mag, but the three at the bottom kind of strike me as being Triple K copies. Seed saving is a great way to ensure the survival of your plants, and it's also an economical choice. Besides coughing up clones of various FN and Mannlicher pistols, Star got in on the Ruby making enterprise in the Great War and in the 1920s began producing a series of innovative handguns such as the curious JO-LO-AR, and their take on John Brownings M1911. Besides Spain, the guns were used by Germany, Finland, and Portugal, among others. Remove the grip panels and the pistol frame. Copyright & Trademarks Remove the magazine from the pistol by pressing the magazine catch release located on the left side of the gun near the trigger guard. XI This is a 9 mm. The Spanish government set up a proof house in Eibar starting in 1923. 1946 = 2. 1989 = AU. 529. If the firearm passed both the visual IV and is, therefore, the original Llama pistol, manufacture of which dates from 1932. Clean and lubricate the individual parts and reassemble. This dates from about 1935 and was produced until about 1954. Though 100% of armor in those early days was tested, this rapidly changed to batch testing, which is what we have now with most firearms. That stands for 1944, impossible for this Llama. Push out the slide stop, then take out the trigger bar and disconnector. Work on a new design began in 1931 and culminated in 1932 with a Spanish patent issued on April 12th of that year. 0000013902 00000 n
1911A1 Colt. Jan 24, 2002 #1. A SPANISH pistol is currently worth an average price of $330.65 new and $202.21 used . The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Privacy Policy. Since approximately Most other countries, do, including Spain. The exact year of manufacture can be found at this link for most Spanish firearms as the date codes were government mandated along with proof marks. The legitimate design patents are usually prefaced by Co." (for Concedido) and during the period 1915 to 1922, when there was a virtual epidemic of new Spanish pistols, these patent numbers ranged from 60,000 to 71,000. Supposedly, this is: However, I have not seen this that I noticed, and a perusal of the few post-1995 guns in my possession doesn't seem to indicate it, and of photos doesn't help either. I except for magazine capacity. Mod. This is located on the underside of the slide, and should slide out with a slight tug. The first three years of proofing (1927-29) were reportedly somewhat confused, so dates of manufacture may vary widely from the stamped date. You might not notice them unless looking, under bright light, at low angles. A place for the discussion of all types of curio & relic firearms, including questions and answers about their markings, origin. The simple blowback .32ACP handgun won a large contract with the French Army, then embroiled in World War I. Pull out the magazine release button and its spring. 0000065199 00000 n
The 12 month average price is $325.41 new and $169.82 used. They were of high quality and have been sold around the world. Victor1911. They are usually on and/or near the front of the trigger guard. The used value of a SPANISH pistol has risen $42.12 dollars over the past 12 months to a . Remove the cylindrical pin, located at the bottom rear of the receiver, which holds the cylinder in place. At the bottom of it is, however, another note. Mod. Find new ways of enjoying your time together, such as playing games and teaching your llama new tricks. Dakin Gun Company Importers of Italian and Spanish Shotguns, c 1960 in San Francisco, California. Numrich Gun Parts Corporation. quote:Originally posted by AdamsQuailHunter. They were of high quality and have been sold around the world. Mod. In addition to the proofmark, it was 0000014473 00000 n
0000017631 00000 n
I have never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as a reason for withdrawing from a friend. All Rights Reserved, Astra, Llama & Star: Spending Time with Some Spanish Pistols. Show your llama that you are trustworthy. Earlier issues had a lanyard ring at bottom of left side of the grip frame, but this ring was omitted in later issues and the grip pieces were redesigned. Make: Llama Model: Martial Serial Number: S806430 Year of Manufacture: 1969-1976 Caliber:.38 Special Action Type: Single and Double Action Revolver with Swing-Out Cylinder Markings: The left side of the barrel is marked "Gabilondo y CIA. Nazi World War Two startxref
K-Mart Classics: Remingtons Nylon Rimfires Engineered To Last. Pull those off (for many guns, like the Firestar, be careful not to move the safety as a plunger can become dislodged and fly away, lost forever when the grips are off) and look if you have no other luck. Though there was another one operating for a short time in the early 1920s, Eibar is the one and only Spanish government proof house for most of the 20th century. Terms and Conditions and Privacy Policy. The oldest of the three by a year, Llama-Gabilondo y Cia SA, best known as Llama, dated back to 1904 when the company ran under the banner of its two principal gunsmiths, Gabilondo y Urresti. 0000006710 00000 n
be submitted to the Eibar Proof House for testing prior to being released Mod. Kingston, NY 12401. Remove the barrel from the slide by pulling it off. date code). The caliber is stamped just below the maker's name, "CAL 7.65M/M (32) "LLAMA"". Created Date: 3/14/2012 10:40:20 AM . The pistol would fail-to-feed every 2 or 3 rounds and the lead would have a smile where it caught on the feed ramp. Somewhat later a variant pattern in 9 mm. Gunswapper Member Posts: 1,006 . Italian Date Codes. Google "Spanish pistol date codes" for a chart. At least one reader has a model PD with, apparently, the month and year of manufacture directly stamped on the frame. VII, but with the addition of a grip safety. 131 0 obj
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SaveShare Reply schutzen-jager Mod. for Pull the slide backward and off the frame. Llama pistol date codes? Learn more in the Cambridge English-Spanish Dictionary. Unscrew and remove the two takedown pins located on either side of the frame, just above the trigger guard. At this point, you will have the main components of the weapon disassembled. Astras most successful design was the 300/400/600 series of pistols, which were very distinctive in their layout, one which was dubbed the Spanish Pipewrench. This Astra 600 in the Guns.com Vault is chambered in 9mm Luger. For year, there is a date code on all Spanish pistols since 1927 Google "Spanish pistol date codes" 11th May 2010, 11:56 #22. In 1980s, firm introduced a new line of pistols that were more modern in design and function. in occupied territories. ACP only. However, their guns remain as a testament to the companys legacy and are a hit with collectors today. Once the pins and screws have been removed, you should be able to disassemble the internal components of the weapon. Commercial proofing. Nope, Llama Martial. Years ser. Roger brought it up this last Feb 2009 before I asked to have a sticky made of the info. Roger, that's a great post, and thank you for that. I This was a 7.65 mm. Sadly, due to a variety of market reasons and competition from Latin American gun makers such as Bersa, Rossi, and Taurus who managed to crowd the Spanish gunmakers out of the import line to North America, Astra and Star closed their doors in the late 1990s, leaving Llama to endure with their Max and Micro Max series guns today. The codes Llama FIREARMS. 0000007436 00000 n
. Take out the trigger, sear and hammer strut located at the rear of the frame. 0000003439 00000 n
0000009048 00000 n
Grasp the slide with one hand, and pull it off of the frame. This is also a good example of how hidden proomarks can be. Proof marks are often very shallow, and in obscure places, like far up the trigger guard. I don't know, but it's not by hijacking an 8 year old dead thread. Additionally, no proof date code means only "pre-1930" not "pre-1927.". My first 1911, but I bought it because the price was right - $125 (this was a few years ago.) Yes, that means there are essentially no standards. The fruit typically ranges from 8 to 10 ounces and is smooth with no blemishes or cracks. Pull the extractor rod located at the back of the frame. Parabellum caliber with a variant style of grip frame and hammer and has no grip safety. I looked under the grips - both sides - nothing there. What did I miss? This pistol is still in production. There are 28 letters or letter-combinations, as explained in the chart below. Classic Browning Light Twelve Auto-5 Review: Busting Clays With the Old Humpback Shotgun. The taller the rib, the more so. 0
Short version of the Mod. Formed as Astra Unceta y Ca in 1908 by Juan Esperanza and Pedro Unceta, Astra would find success with their in-house developed Campo-Giro pistol only a few years later when it was adopted by the Spanish Army. 1945 = 1. IV. For Llama pistols built prior to 1936 slide marking reads: "GABILONDO Y CIA ELOEIBAR (ESPANA) CAL 9MM/.380IN LLAMA". 88_cnkqXyV0 pyxq>2!-bOg1?9C#4(q0alVife.WtYYOu.kv-siKpeb*NXVep!<1e2&8&Ss6O|:fJ"*|TYx@\d %oR}^hlsB`uATLtdF$T,>)O6<>gl@7//lXQ^f4'hB,:_4y&_y~KpL(;fv-2KI2_ M47x{d~,/kZu;,,csD@c;7:,`:/^|\z#WBa5-9@CECpFH9QP#(+-d9L4dE88&'q 9 !l, 2W P4=TDpARA0\@ ^% #AI\fR "l2ut m `. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. If you like interesting and often rare guns like these Spanish classics, be sure to check out ourCollectors Corneror look through our entire catalog of more than3,000 new and used guns of all sorts. After WWI, Gabilondo y Urresti changed the company name to Llama and updated their catalog with several updates to the Colt M1911 design, which remained in production as the Llama Max series into the 2000s, as well as revolvers such as the Comanche and Martial series, which were cloned S&Ws in many respects. Several styles of grip pieces and markings have been noted. Stronger Guns. 7.65M/M (32) "LLAMA"". Although I do not specifically address it, this should therefore work for Astras, Llamas, and any other handgun. It was an imitation of Colt Mod. 0000024965 00000 n
The table below indicates the various year codes. 0000008413 00000 n
1968 = XXIV. All Spanish guns since ~1928 have a date code on them. Back to "Llama" The codes are the same whether it's a Llama, a Star, or an Astra The three proof marks indicate receipt at the proof house, passing of proof, and the date of proofing. stamped with a letter code indicating the year that the arm passed proof. Largo (Bergmann) caliber. MUGICA Tradename on Llama pistols made for Jose Mugica of Eibar, Spain. The latter would include the Star Model A and B, the Modelo Super, compact Star BKS/BM, Star M-series, and even the Mustang-sized Star DK. Remove the cylinder pin located at the front of the frame and above the barrel. 0000018357 00000 n
III-A This post-World War II version of Mod. SPANISH PROOF MARKS PrOOF mark CirCa PrOOF hOuse tYPe OF PrOOF and gun since 1910 Eibar provisional black powder proof for shotguns . Mod. the earlly pistols had smooth slides, then the rib appeared in the 1950s. 0000010495 00000 n
Get creative! A document sent to me some time ago, and which I just now noticed, is the same sheet as the above table from the nice people at Ipar Guns. Star Firearms Production Dates By Year Code Dates of Production by Model for Llama FIREARMS Since approximately 1927, Spanish law has required that every firearm manufactured in Spain be submitted to the Eibar Proof House for testing prior to being released for sale. If they are just standard models not customized, then $500-$600 for both sounds more like it to me. # start ser. 528. It was made prior to World War II only. Date Codes" in this section. Mod. LLAMA Compact Frame Semi-Automatic :: Gun Values by Gun Digest Back LLAMA > Compact Frame Semi-Automatic Compact Frame Semi-Automatic 9mm or .45 ACP caliber semi-automatic pistol, with 4.25" barrel and 7- or 9-shot detachable magazine. Take out the base pin, located at the front of the frame and above the trigger. 0000012824 00000 n
Probably the same year though, so its a good guide. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. 0000070705 00000 n
Ensure the weapon is unloaded. These were . 0000079047 00000 n
S&W K-frame 4-inch .38 Special? Browning caliber, original blowback style, dating from about 193'31934, first issued without model designation, with factory catalog designation No. Parabellum caliber was produced. panels. Ensure that the gun is unloaded by removing the magazine and visually inspecting the chamber. Both are identical to the Llama Mod. Welcome to the updated GunBroker.com forums. Fixed sights. Llama manufactured moderate-priced revolvers and self-loading pistols in a bewildering variety of models. VI This has been reported to be in 9 mm. 0000079298 00000 n
for sale. Spanish shops quickly began making their own copies of this very popular pistol, and one of them hit the proverbial jackpot. The Ukrainian Tribute Growout is a great opportunity for tomato lovers to get their hands on some unique and delicious varieties. In order to participate in the GunBroker Member forums, you must be logged in with your GunBroker.com account. However, there is a completely different system of date codes and maker codes that . It was produced from 1936 and was still made in 1953 but does not appear in 1955 factory literature. September 2018 edited November 2018. Remove the slide from the frame. Llama IIIA series 1 variation 1- 380 acp, Locked breech,161 mm overall length, three vents in the rib, 1955 into 1969. 0000005854 00000 n
Mod. A forum community dedicated to all firearm owners and enthusiasts. 0000060510 00000 n
Furthermore, if you're growing heirloom varieties or rare species that may not, This website uses cookies for functionality, analytics and advertising purposes as described in our. 0000017260 00000 n
Although many other countries have military acceptance marks as well, I do not know their design; if anyone does know for sure, please send me a good quality photo or other reference information. I assume the Star chart is accurate for the Llama? All the examples on this page are highlighted in crayon; yours will not be this visible. The flaming torch is also used in the same type grip. I, to which no model number was originally assigned. Lift the recoil spring guide and spring out of the gun. In 1995 serial numbers began to follow a coded system. with a variety of proofmarks. This logo is said to have been used on the Mexican made Llamas but they were III-A's. Also used by Spain in the early years. Come join the discussion about optics, hunting, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! It is still in production. Other regions have different proof houses with different marks and codes. http://web.jet.es/rafa/b_punzones_larga_lisa.html. The code should be found on the left side of the frame just above the trigger or under the frame and it will be identified by a * over the letter or a * over the letter and number year code. Any ideas as to the date of manufacture??? A representative sample of each lot of weapons is tested with a proofing cartridge, which has vastly higher pressure than the normal specifications. Current production Llama pistols will show a slide marking with "LLAMA CAL" or "GABILONDO Y CIA VITORIA (ESPANA)" and Llama logo. There are no Llama pistols designated as Models XII, XIII, and XIV as these designations have been reserved for and are used on the Llama revolvers. Principal among these was a trio of pistol and revolver makers that operated primarily from the Eibar area in northern Spains Basque region Astra, Llama, and Star. I am not sure the same coding scheme is used for long arms, but try it and if it sounds right, it might be. X-A This is identical to Mod. Llama pistol is still produced today. Apr 1, 2007. 1911. Place your fingers through the trigger guard and grasp the handle firmly. The proof date code should be a letter, followed by a number from 1955 onward, e.g. Elgoiba (Espana). Try posting on the Spanish Pistol forum on Gunboards, there's some very knowledgeable Spanish / Llama folks over there. models of 1903, 1906, 1910, and 1922. It might appear on the box label, however, so everyone look around and tell me if that seems true. Gustav Genschow AG in Hamburg, and accordingly marked on the left side of The web site that has the codes does not mention it, but there is a small * above and between the letter and the number. 0000016042 00000 n
Very nice gift, specially with the extra magazines. 0000014749 00000 n
This is a post-World War II production. This model was produced until about 1954. Push down on the slide lock lever located at the rear of the gun and pull the slide back. LLama Model I was a blowback pistol based on Browning designs and was introduced in 1933. JavaScript is disabled. "Spanish Year Of MFG. gun was exported to a different country as a military acquisition. Date of manufacture for Spanish handguns. Mod. In the companys later years, they produced guns geared towards the concealed carry market like the Firestar and Ultrastar. IX-A This is the .45 ACP caliber, to which a grip safety was added immediately following World War II. 0000001316 00000 n
Which is a coded date. The caliber is stamped just below the maker's name, "CAL 0000004721 00000 n
Phone: 866.686.7424. 0000070355 00000 n
Also think like the manufacturer. As for his price being overinflated, at $500-$600 for each, to me yes his price is very inflated. Though this system works fine for the Eibar-based Star, use care when trying to proof-date a gun by another Spanish maker. Every 28 years or so (there are inexplicable gaps) they start a new series, by adding a number to the end of the letter codes. It may be a special variant of the Mod. 0000034833 00000 n
However, factory literature of 1936-39 shows this model in .45 cal. commercial contract Spanish Gabilondo Y Cia "Llama" Model I semi-auto Remove the slide stop pin from the frame. I am surprised no one has answered you on this. Just use this handy translation code list. VII. The first pistol produced was an exact copy of the Colt Mod. Place the weapon on a flat surface in an area with adequate lighting. %%EOF
Click the sign-in button at the top right of the forums page to get connected. the frame "GECO". Llama Date code chart.
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